Blog Asks “If Michelle Was White.” More Like Could Harold Ford Jr. Get Elected Dogcatcher In Blackland?

The Chicago Tribune’s Exploring Race blog has posed the question “What if Michelle Obama was white?” This “well, duh” question has already been explored by most black blogs and the universal answer is that he wouldn’t have even been a senator, let alone president.

But they asked anyway, you know, for poops and giggles I suppose and they will likely get some passionate responses (and passionate responses to those responses), but the reality is despite all of our progress in the better acceptance of interracial couples, it’s hard to get elected to office when you are a black person married a white person.

Case in point: Former Tennessee Rep. Harold Ford, Jr. who I wrote about earlier this year. A member of our quasi “black aristocracy” (as in he comes from a political family of influence and means), Ford reached prominence on his family name and good looks, then ran a campaign for the senate where he lost by a narrow margin. Some say he was hurt by his religious pandering. Others say he was hurt by a Republican backed commercial that portrayed Ford as a white woman chasing, playboy bunny hound.

Which was kind of, sort of true, but mean/racist because what did that have to do with being a senator? Then Ford married Emily Threlkeld and ALL. KINDS. OF. HELL. broke loose in “Blackland.”

Comments from Big Head DC’s blog:

“I think he has not given his political career any thought. If he runs for any office again, surely he won’t win. You don’t carry the black vote and marry white. I will never vote for him again.”– Pat, Memphis

“The reason so many blacks are upset is because Harold Ford Jr. has always courted the black vote and black people except when it comes to his marriage. I am sure when he is running for office and goes into the black neighborhoods he will not take his white wife along. This also gives black women the assumption that as black men progress their appreciation of black women decreases. It also gives the impression that they are saying “I have made it and here is my trophy”!!!!!” — Connie, Memphis

“The only use Harold had for blacks period in the 9th Congressional Dist was votes. After 10 years of his representation we ALL need Anus Reconstruction Surgery. He did a number on us. This young man took Self Serving Politician to a new level.” — Anonymous

And there is this long, over-the-top, angry note which pretty much sums up how well this all went over with some blacks. It essentially accuses Ford of treason, then slaps him around for a perceived slight against Martin Luther King, Jr.:

This couple had the nerve to have their engagement party on MLK’s 40th anniversary marking his assassination in Memphis. This was very disrespectful to the dead leader and to the community. It was insensitive and disrespectful to have an engagement party on this day at all. However adding injury to insult, MLK and his black wife did not make the sacrifices that they did so that well off black men can marry white women as trophies. (Seventy) of black families are being raised by single mothers, which is leading to the deterioration of the country as a whole. Children who are abandoned by their fathers are becoming negative statistics and impacting the entire society. Many black men do not value black women enough to marry them and raise their families, partially due to the after effects of slavery and the medias propaganda that white women are more desirable and should be valued. As a politician this man is supposed to be a role model, by this action he is setting the example that well off black men should abandon their responsibilities to their communities and marry trophy white women who should be valued more than black women. His fiancée is an unattractive woman, with a seemingly mediocre background and would probably never have married an attractive well off man of her own race. So one would get the impression that this is not love, but that he is showcasing a white “trophy” on MLK’s anniversary, which is the height of disrespect and in my opinion shows that he is brainwashed, confused and needs deprogramming. Many people view this marriage as political suicide.

You don’t have to be an sociologist or a psychologist to figure out that despite our progress there are a still a lot insecurities in the black community and nothing brings them out more passionately than that shunted feeling black people (especially black women) get when black men who “make it” marry outside their race.

When you’re used to getting kicked around it’s hard not to take it personal. Even I get that feeling from time-to-time and I like to considering myself pretty egalitarian about the issue. I’m almost two people about it with the logical side of my brain saying people should be judged by their character and can marry whomever they want because their marriage is about them, not me and I wouldn’t want someone nosing in my personal business, casting judgment on my intentions.

But my gut wants to strangle Elin Woods.

It’s insane because Tiger Woods is not my personal property, so what do I care? Yet I do. This is because I grew up watching black women get unceremoniously dumped all the time. Or seeing them not in the running at all as viable mates. I can’t help it. I take it personal, but I temper my response, my logic reminding me that this is NOT about me.

Plus, being a trophy wife isn’t exactly an ideal thing, considering a lot of it is hedged
on your appearance, but it’s the wanting to be desired that gets us. Everyone wants to be desired. Everyone. Especially black women. Hence why being married to a white person, particularly a black man married to a white woman, is a death knell to getting the black vote.

Black women and older black voters make up the bulk of the black vote and they are the ones most likely to not approve due to that giant “I’ve been personally affronted!” feeling they would have every time they’d see someone like Emily Threlkeld’s smiling face. And any smart person running against someone like Ford would use this rift against him, never quite saying he was a sell-out, but would repeatedly question his loyalty to his constituents, arguing that Ford would only serve his own interests, not that of the community.

It just wouldn’t work. All things aren’t that equal in Blackland yet.

Not that white people are 100 percent comfortable with this notion either. There’s a reason why a lot of politicians are as personally boring as possible (straight, married to someone who is not “exotic” in any kind of way, Christian, usually with some kids), because that’s what voters what. There are exceptions to the rule (Jeb Bush is married to a Latina — but then he was governor of Florida, so that probably helped him), but for most politicians the rule of the day is to be married, preferrably within their own ethnicity and religious sect, be Christian, be heterosexual and not to have any kink in the closest that could come out to haunt them.

(Like paid hookers or interns or Euro sex clubs or nasty text messages or cocaine or secret half-black, out-of-wedlock children or male pages or hook-up trolling in airport men’s restrooms.)

None of that stuff. Can’t have it. Americans are both notorious freaks and prudes all at the same time, hence all the politicians have to at least be able to appear as close to June and Ward Cleaver as possible. People want the fantasy. They will vote for the fantasy.

For many in Blackland, a white woman is simply not part of that fantasy.

172 thoughts on “Blog Asks “If Michelle Was White.” More Like Could Harold Ford Jr. Get Elected Dogcatcher In Blackland?

  1. “isn’t going to drastically change the desirability rate for African American women in this country, than I say to you, as a man, respectfully, that you got another thing coming.”I don’t recall saying otherwise. I know guys of other races who found themselves interested in dating black women after seeing an En Vogue video. Great. ” But on a dark night in Jasper Texas, what on God’s green earth does that self-defintion have to do with how you’re treated by the majority?”So we allow ourselves to be defined by ignorant rednecks? Oh yeah, that’s brilliant. Sorry, nobody defines me but me. That’s not empowering or liberating. What I don’t understand is why black people would want folks who are only calling themselves black out of fear. Are we really that desperate and pathetic? Frankly, I think we should be MORE exclusive and stop running around claiming folk who don’t want to be claimed. And for the record, Woods said he coined that term when he was a child. Right now my child wants to be an astronaut, a superhero and a bird. Are you going to be pissed with him if the bird isn’t black?

  2. @ RoslynYou wrote: “Right now my child wants to be an astronaut, a superhero and a bird. Are you going to be pissed with him if the bird isn’t black?”No. Of course not.But it begs a question. Who explains to him that he’s going to face an increased amount of difficulty achieving all those wonderful dreams because of the color of his skin? You … or his father?

  3. To all those singing that “Ebony and Ivory” bull….WHATEVER!Barack had me at MICHELLE. Seriously, if Michelle had been Mindy with blonde hair, he probably would have gotten my primary vote…but I would not have volunteered, would not have donated money, would not have been enthused about his candidacy…so call me shallow, call me irrational…like I care…its the truth and its the truth for the majority of black women, lets not kid ourselves on that one. I love Michelle and even more so, Mama Robinson…..LOVE IT! The pic of Barack holding her hand on election night…priceless! I would like to say though, that I have often said I would have loved to have been able to talk to his grandmother, “Toot”…that was a special woman – and her husband as well. I’m still trying to wrap my head around these two people from KANSAS of all places, in the 60s, taking in their daughter and her child by a Kenyan…not just a black man from Detroit or Atlanta, but KENYA…like my daddy says..those were some special people….but anyway, as I said….Barack had me at Michelle.

  4. Breeding out? Loss of ethnicity and identity? WTF??? Are you kidding me? Who says that? ______Call it what you want. I tend not to sugar coat my words. My comments were not so much directed to you personally as I am speaking to a larger picture. Make no mistake, you and I both know racial mixing is apart our history as African-Americans. When I say “breed out” I’m talking about the tendency to believe our problems in as individuals (black men/women) will only be solved in union with “other” instead moving to address the underlying issues. We seem to have little desire to hold on to ourselves. The evidence is all around. This is not to suggest SOME would not engage in interracial relationships regardless of these ills. I am not so closed minded as to believe each and every pairing is a result of the need for validation or status. However, I believe it does speak volumes that now even ads are pairing black women with white men because they’ve been listening to the new “savior” theme amongst our educated sista set. I also believe the lack of color on the arms of our wealthier men (and now even the poor ones are looking for Latina) has been saying something loud. Instead of facing each other face to face, we’re running. Just like the AIDS issue. Just like the fatherlessness issue.

  5. My feelings are torn. God knows who we are supposed to love and spend the rest of our lives with before we were even born. So if a black man marries a white woman, this could possibly be a match made in heaven, literally. But then I witness discrimination against the black female, especially those of darker complexion, from black men who are my cousins. What the Hell?!?I admit that I cheer internally when I see a black woman with a white man. In high school the black guys, especially the popular ones, only dated white girls no matter how pretty or ugly they were.Question: Why is it that a white woman can look like Roseann and be good enough but the black woman has to look like Beyonce? Why must the black woman be flawless?My cousin married a white woman. He’s college educated…..she admitted that she barely graduated from high school. I know for a fact that my cousin just married her because she’s white. He’s admitted that “black women have too much attitude.” All the while, he constantly mentally abuses her by talking down to her and telling her she needs to lose weight. Her response: nothing.Most black men are intimidated by strong black females and they want to be number one. Well to hell with those men who can not accept black women because we don’t take their crap.

  6. So I’m reading a lot of these comments and I’m a little shocked about the amount of people who have said they know black men that have dated white women or any type of white woman just because they are white. I’m not naive and know that this does exist but I did not know as much as people are saying.I am a black dude who has no problem with dating outside of his race. I have dated white women before, Puerto Rican you name it. I found women in general beautiful no matter the color of thier skin. I have never not been attracted to black women, but I think in my case it may be the environment I have always been in. I grew up mostly around white people, went to school, college with mostly whites and some of my best friends are white. Of course when you hang out with this many white people you’re going to start talking to the white girls or vice versa, and that is what has really happened to me. I have never really had access to an overabundance of black women. Maybe that’s my fault who knows, but that’s my story and I’m pretty comfortable with that because I know who I am and the color of my skin and would not change that for the world. I feel that black women are amazing and sexy and would be with one in a heartbeat if she was cool and we were feeling each other not just because she is black.And for those who are shocked when they date white women and find out that they have issues and dont’ have the magic clit that some people are programmed into believing, they are ignorant. This may sound sexist but a lot of women have issues period. Rather it’s societel, personal or whatnot black, white, asian whatever they are gonna have some sort of issue/insecurity you may have to deal with.One last thing on this extraordinary long post…I sometimes think that black women do not find me attractive or are not drawn to me for whatever reason. I’m a good looking guy, well educated bachelors and master’s degree, decent job would treat any woman like a queen, yet I get all this attention from white women. I had a black friend of mine say to me that I was every white girls fantasy I guess beacuse I was the “safe” black guy for a white girl to bring home to mommmy and daddy. I guess my question here is to the black women who are looking for a good black man, what attracts you to them or what are you looking for because I gurantee I got it all here, yet white women feel me more often then black women. And to the post about black man being intimidated by strong black females…not the case here that’s sexy

  7. TYK27,I’d like to see your picture. Are you more like Carlton from The Fresh Prince? If that’s you I could understand white women being drawn to you. My brother is like that, basically he is a white guy in black skin.

  8. Anonymous, I put a pic up…if that’s the case about your brother that’s kind of messed up that people have that stereotype that you have to act a certain way, dress and talk a certain way if your black. If you dont your considered white. I would like to think that we are passed that racism within our race but we are not. The friend that said I was a white girls fantasy also made a comment that I talk like a white guy, what’s talking like a white guy? Because I talk like I have sense half of the time, I’m acting white? Me and her fought for over a year about that, haha, but the stereotypes that live within the black community placed on ourselves is maddenning sometimes and we all do it to a certain extent, it’s a shame because it holds us back…

  9. TYK27 and anonymous: Oh no! Folks are not up in here “networking” up in the Harold Ford Jr./Michelle Obama/Interracial dating thread! LOL! I’m glad I could be of service … and 112 comments! Man, people. Is it that raw?That is all.

  10. Anonymous @ 8:28 -The issues you raise need to be raised within the community and at home. This is similar to the talented 10th leaving the Black community at the first chance of integration and social mobility. Do we blame these folks for seeking something that was right for them and their families? No. Yeah we need to have more talking and more understanding but how do we do that? Its easy to sit on the sidelines and bitch but I don’t follow or cooperate until Leadership is shown and attitude shifts are present.

  11. SuggestionSnob you need to have a “single men of color” issue like the annual 50 single men – there are some nice looking guys and it would be a service to the single ladies to bring our community together.TYK27 and Nate Jones could lead off.

  12. Skywalker…The damage is done. This has been a problem since the beginning of time. We could have all of the community forums we want on this issue and we will still be in blogs talking the same talk and black men walking the same walk. As long as there are outside forces that put it in everyone’s head that the white woman is superior to all women, things will never change.Solution? There is no solution. Discrimination is here to stay…even if it’s within the same race. And people sitting on the sidelines bitching will still continue because of this.TYK27, I didn’t say ALL black men are intimated, I said SOME. Maybe you’re not and that’s a great thing, but there are men like my cousins who are intimidated by black women who hold their own ground.

  13. Anon @ 10:40 amSince you don’t have hope why you don’t you just stay on the sidelines bitch all you want and watch some change happen. Not all BM are bad, not all BM are in IRs and not all those that are don’t think poorly on BW or the Black community. YOU have issues that YOU need to resolve. Its easy to hate but its hard to love and understand. Its easy to have that “world’s over, its bad” attitude that keeps communities in the same place for years/decades/generations. Try changing your view for a sec. Try seeing it for what it could and should be and not for what it is.Yeah, we need to question established rules and what not but that gets us thinking asking ourselves how to move forward. Hate/Bitch all you want but unless you got something to contribute you can wave as I and many who want to move forward through unification of the internal and external communities pass you by.

  14. I know I should leave this alone but I have only one question to ask….The one excuse I hear black men use for dating out is that where they were everyone was white….I CALL BULL.If sistas are enrolling in college at a rate of 3:1, it stands to reason that wherever you are there are more Black women there than there are Black men even when Black people are in the minority, right?This is a pile of crap in my opinion. I went to an elite liberal arts college on the East Coast, where there were definitely more Black women than Black men, even though Black people as a whole made up just 10% of the population. Even then, the guys dated white and the girls cried. This was not the hood where all the Black girls were rolling their necks and snapping their fingers. This was ‘Jack and Jill’-ville …..My thing is do whatever you want but dont lie to me or to yourself….Read about the Brown University ‘Wall of Shame’ started by a sista to chronicle all the black guys that were dating white girls…. Again, I dont care, I am after all dating a white guy but I am honest with myself about why. I want to meet a Black guy who will tell me to my face, I date white chicks because I like white chicks, I think they are prettier, I want my kids to have good hair and light skin,and I want other black men to look at me and envy me my white wife…heck even I like pink nipples is a better excuse than this shitty ‘woe is me’ story of I was the only Black person at my school. We all went to that school and I am not buying it.

  15. Read this at Evia’s Blog tought it as interesting. I don’t think she is crazy I think she makes sense. She also claims to be happily married.To Choose or Not to Choose an AA man–When I was younger and dated the “typical” AA man, I had choices among AA men and other men. I had the choice to choose an AA man. I discovered that a typical AA men either wasn’t willing to or couldn’t give me what I needed, so this is why I left AA men alone. I knew that if I got into a relationship with one of them, he would know I was always on the verge of escaping and this would be dangerous for me. I wasn’t about to allow him to work out his frustrations on me!! Oh NO. I could have easily ended up on the other end of his fist—as those wealthy black women in PG county, Maryland have experienced. Please go to my PONDERING section and read the articles there that Felicia has found about what’s going on in some of those gilded cages. I don’t know whether that’s been covered on Oprah or by any high profile media person. SMH I wasn’t willing to even “try” to come up with a brand new vetting system to vet an AA man—or cut him any slack, which is what many AA women are pressured to do. That would have been an exercise in “trial and error” and my life and that of my children would have been at stake. Remember that cutting a man slack means that the woman is going to have to take up the slack. If she starts out doing that, he will expect her to continue and when she complains, this is usually when her face meets his fist. BW: There is ONE standard way of evaluating ALL men in world and AA men are no exception—that is, if a survival and thriving oriented woman is going to look out for her and her children’s interests. All women in all cultures and societies in the world use this standard rule that starts with a question. Here is the MAIN question you should be able to answer in a positive way if you are to continue spending romantic time with ANY man: How well can he provide and protect me and any children we might have and is he “SHOWING” me in small and other ways **from the start** that he’s willing to do that? If you have to hem and haw about this answer and come up with a long explanation about why he can’t do that, or maybe this or that, then you are wasting your time and you should prepare yourself and your children (if there are any) for much unnecessary suffering. However, AA women are pressured in a variety of ways to NOT use that standard vetting system when it comes to AA men, and this is what causes so much confusion and disaster. This often leaves many individual bw to have to come up with their own, individual, untested vetting system and this is why many young black women are left holding the “evidence” when he abandons her and the children. Okay, this is where I part company with some of the other bw empowerment bloggers, but of course, we’re not going to agree on every point since we aren’t the same person–unless I’m schizophrenic and off my meds. LOL! I don’t think and I will NEVER think or believe one iota that a female is any more responsible than a male for any children that might come from their sexual union. I won’t ever support any position that doesn’t require them BOTH to face equivalent consequences for their abandonment or mistreatment of their children. I’m never going to blame the woman MORE for having a womb or her social predicament of being left with children because she doesn’t have to remain in that social predicament. The woman could ALSO abandon the children after birth. Have y’all noticed the irony of this situation? Since the babymama doesn’t abort or abandon the children, she is left holding the “evidence” and thus she gets the full force of the penalty for a “crime” that both he and she equally committed. LOL! Since the babydaddy has shed the evidence, he escapes the lion’s share of the blame—at least in the eyes of most AAs. The babymama is sentenced to hard time for life and much denigration from AAs and a host of lost opportunities simply because she kept possession of the evidence. I think we’d better think long and hard about this situation because a female can also shed ALL of the evidence, and more of them are doing it. Only among AAs is the AA male not held equally responsible for his children or to the same standard as other males for being providers and protectors of women and children. Other groups of males still have standards and do everything in their power to extinguish this type of egregious irresponsibility among their own males to the point of using severe penalties. The MEN among them do that. They at least, put into place various measures to send the message that they won’t tolerate it. I know for a fact that white males and Nigerian male babydaddies are held in low regard by most other males among them, whereas many times, AA males shrug, high-five each other and blame the mothers of their children for being stupid hoochies and such and face no social penalties from each other AT ALL. This is why many other groups consider AA males worth less. Anyway, when I was a young woman, I wanted a regular, “normal” Quality man for a mate–one who could be held to a similar standard as any other “normal” man in the world, without any expectation for me to “cut him slack” So I opted early in my social life away from AA men. I would advise other AA women who want to avoid having to set up a brand new ‘trial and error’ vettting system and the rest of the whole nine to do the same.As more and more bw escape, it’ll be worse than Armageddon for a LOT of these parasites who view black women as their cushion, their insurance policy, their cash crop, their security blankie, their buffer from the rigors of real life, their safety net, their booty for cheap or free sperm depositories, their meal ticket, their loyal family slaves, etc. When you think about the enormous lack of reciprocity, the sexual use and abuse of bw’s bodies, and the sheer volume of physical and emotional brutality involved, the male abandonment of children, etc. in a lot of the AA intraracial male-female relationships or interactions, it’s actually a REPEAT of the ole plantation system, except that AA women have become the NEW slaves–to be used at will by bm and perpetually made to feel that they are less than and stupid, that no other type of man could possibly want them because they’re too ugly and dark, with bad attitudes, and that we can’t make it anywhere else but in the bc. Isn’t that the same spiel the white massas taught our captured ancestors to keep them on the plantation? It’s a REPEAT of the same program. There’s nothing new or creative here. And since it’s a repeat, AA women ought to be able to predict and sidestep the tactics being used now and those that will be employed in the future to keep us in “our place.”

  16. @ Snob: Ain’t that the truth! I have nothing to say just that I honestly don’t give a damn who people marry. I just know I have a preference for black, hispanic, Middle Eastern, and Asian men. A white guy would really have to stand out for me to be interested because I prefer more ethnic looks.

  17. Skywalker..I advise you to read more carefully. I never said ALL black men are bad. I never said ALL black men didn’t care about their community. But there are SOME, let me repeat, SOME who don’t prefer black women because of the color of their skin and the stereotype of black women and attitudes.I’m sorry if a lot of people don’t look through rose colored glasses like you, but discrimination is here to stay. Yes we’ve come a long way, but we still haven’t reached the point of not completely judging people by the color of their skin. Yes we have a black president, but there are still people who want him dead because of the color of his skin. I NEVER said that people couldn’t change but I trully believe the only place where we will be free from discrimination is heaven. That’s why God made heaven so we would have something to look forward to from the hurt and pain and yes discrimination we have here on earth. Fifty years, 100 years, 1,000 years from now the topic of interracial dating and marriage will still be a hot topic no matter how much CHANGE we as a people accomplish.You say you’re not sitting on the “sidelines”, so what exactly are you doing to make change on this topic? Inquiring minds would like to know.

  18. first: wow, that a lot of comments.But I think I may have an inkling of what it feels like. I am white, but i lived in japan for a year. I am also brunette with dark eyes. So, while there I never got flirted with once. Not even a second glance. All the western guys wanted to date the Japanese girls , and all the Japanese guys wanted to date a blonde or redhead. I felt so dejected and unattractive, and if that is how you ladies feel, you have every right to be angry. No woman should feel so alienated by their own culture.

  19. In response to one of the many anonymous posters or the one who said a black man is lying to himself and other BW by saying he dosen’t date BW because of the lack of them in his environment, first of all you do not know me or others who may stake that claim lifes story. I currently work in a profession that caters to golf, guess what not a lot of black women there…do i like white girls, hell yea, do I like black girls hell yea, it really does not matter to me…nobody’s lying to anyone about why they date outside of there race at least in my case…

  20. I am an AA woman dating a white man (been together 5 years). I read this article and immediately began to think, am I jeopardizing my bf’s future simply because I am black? I have also been subject to all sorts of “Oreo” commentary from black men and women alike. So what if I have currently have a preference for MY white man? (My first bf was a black African, my second was Honduran, by the way). I think I would still be dating my current boyfriend if he were any other race/ethnicity, because of his character. In my professional life, I consistently work WITH the black community to advance ourselves, I EDUCATE other white people (including my bf) about positive AND negative aspects of AA/Caribbean culture, and BREAK the stereotypes that we keep on perpetuating by isolating and dividing ourselves. I think it is simply stupid for people to forclose opportunities to fall in love because they are concerned about their image, credibility, career, etc. Shoot, I am in a white-dominated profession, and dating a white man is certainly not “helping” me to advance myself. It is up to ME. Obama’s “no drama” policy could have been construed as an “anti-black” sentiment since we are very much associated with drama in all its forms (baby mama drama, gang drama, political drama, etc.). But no, Obama was elected, and he was elected by a WHITE friggin majority. So why do we feel so much “responsibility” for his success? He did it his damn self, by being the dignified, intelligent, and genuine person he is. He does not reject his white heritage, and he does not reject his African roots. What should that say to us? Self-dejection and inordinate blame on the “other” will get you nowhere. We put up our own barriers. My father always said to me, “There always has to be a cause of death, but our people [we are Caribbean] always dramatize it by inventing some voodoo or curse. Why can’t we just die of “natural causes” or “old age”? This is what has happened to politics. In our rush to Monday-morning quarterback, we blame Harold Ford’s “apparent” rejection of the black community for his failures as a person. Can’t he just have NOT been successful? Can there NOT be a “Bradley effect”? I am also from Florida. So yeah, Jeb Bush’s Latina wife helped him garner the vote, but basically ONLY in Southern Florida. But wait, its Cubans, who are primarily anti-Democrat because of their supposed plans to open up trade to Cuba. It’s still a red state, people (except this year :-P).

  21. Well, as a high school dropout of Mexican (actually Californio but no one knows about US) ancestry I must beg you to have some pity on those women who aren’t Rhodes Scholars, or who don’t have advanced degrees from the ivy league.We aren’t all animals, and some of our beloved grandmothers were nannies at one time or another. We may be unschooled but we can be quite charming and loving people. Maybe Tiger saw THAT in Elin.It’s best not to try to dismiss people from the roles of deserving humanity, either on the basis of melanin production OR schooling.My grandpa only graduated high school and was the dearest man in the world and made my life a joy so it’s awfully hard to accept such a random and sweeping dismissal of the worthiness of people based upon something that is so removed from their true worth and goodness.That said, I also have felt, and quite strongly, the implication that I was not the attrractive or desired thing in this society.Few things hurt so much or cause so much damage to ones soul and sense of self worth.

  22. And Queenie, you are right about the whole educated/non-educated division within minority communities. I mean, black people still flip out when people move out of the neighborhood to be “closer to whitey.” And a lot of educated black people make a ridiculous effort to stay away from the hood. Obama has found a happy medium – he did his community organizing, and learned the value of grassroots organizing. His success depended on the collaboration of PhDs, high school dropouts, grandmothers, college students, nannies, and everyone in between. Street smarts and common sense does not come from school. Politics in America is definitely not only for the elitely educated. And even those who have the right names on their resume can be as dumb as a stump (i.e. GW Bush). Bravo, Queenie.

  23. Haha at RainaHavock…we talk about it all the time. I just cannot get married to someone when both of us have massive school debts to pay. Can anyone get me a job in DC?

  24. To anon@ at whateverChill – I do my part(mentoring my siblings, being involved with my Church parish which is 100% non white non Black kids). The point I’m making is we get no where and I mean NO where by pointing fingers. Every difference counts. I show people that I have strong relationship with my husband, my family and friends, and my faith. We should encouraging models within our community and externally. That’s what my parents taught me. That’s the way I’m going to live.

  25. Queenie,Girl that kitty with the gun is strange baby. But you know what I think I like your style girl. What is with the sniper kitty cat?

  26. Thank you Anonymous!That killer kitten has been all over the web. Exactly what it’s supposed to symbolize and who originally created itare probably both lost in the mists of online history. I like it because I’m fond of the idea of something as traditionally defenceless as a kitten suddenly deciding to fight back.And I’m a huge sucker for cats. The keep you warm in the winter, and provide a source of meat when the great famine comes (just joking)

  27. I know pretty everybody has already added their input, but I’m adding mine because it’s not just adults and politicians doing it, it’s boys too.Of course it should be your choice of who you marry, but it does bother me and my other black friends when we see almost the majority of all the black boys at our school chasing after white girls. There’s a certain, “well what’s wrong with chocolate girls?” aspect to it that even my mom said she went through in her day. It probably wouldn’t bother me as much if it didn’t look like the only girls they chased after were white. But that’s definitely the way it looks. And it bothers me.In respect to Barack marrying Michelle, I shamelessly admit it makes me giddy to see real black love on such a national level. I like that Obama married a real chocolate girl from the Southside of Chicago. If he would’ve married a white woman, I wouldn’t have had any problem with it. I just wouldn’t be as inspired I guess. There’s just something about it.

  28. ArtchessI feel what you’re saying. When I was in school all of the black guys dated the white girls, no matter how ugly they were. Another thing I noticed is the white girls practically threw themselves on the black guys. This is the main reason why black guys love them some white girls because they will do ANYTHING, and I mean anything to get the black guy.Don’t buy into the hype of “black girls aren’t into me” or the infamous excuse of “I’m surrounded by more white girls than black”. No the real reason is that society has put into everyone’s head that white girls are the cream of the crop and black guys believe it’s true.

  29. “Don’t buy into the hype of “black girls aren’t into me” or the infamous excuse of “I’m surrounded by more white girls than black.”I’m really sorry to say but it’s not hype. Maybe that’s an excuse about there being a lack of black women in my environment, but can’t you say the same thing about black women who are high up in the corporate world and refuse to date IR but have slim pickings of black guys in their environment? It can go both ways if you want to throw that hype or BS card on black guys that say that. And why am I the only dude on here responding to posts??I do agree that we are programmed from the media and the rest of the world that white girls are the ultimate prize. It’s getting a little better but definitely a long way to go, but please do not say somebody is not telling the truth about why they date outside of their race. In my experience I am not looking for the girl that’s the ultimate prize because of the color of her skin.

  30. Anonymous:Exactly! The white girls are all over them and it annoys the crap out of me. The black boys just take it all in too. Don’t buy into the hype of “black girls aren’t into me” or the infamous excuse of “I’m surrounded by more white girls than black”. No the real reason is that society has put into everyone’s head that white girls are the cream of the crop and black guys believe it’s true.yeah ia. The boys at my school always use the excuse that all the black girls are “ghetto”. While it’s true that you do have your chosen girls who act like they don’t have any sense, they are plenty more that do. I hate bs like that.TYK27:I guess I can agree with you a little bit. But some people do use that as an excuse and do lie about it. Sometimes they’re plenty of black women around you, and they chase after white women anyway. So if you like white women, just say so.

  31. How is Tiger Woods more asian than black? He’s half and half. And as far as the bs he gives of “my dad is half indian and black”, well ALL black people have indian in them. Actually, no one race is pure anything. We all have different mixtures of blood in us.In my opinion, dating and marrying interracially is okay IF the people in the relationship really care about each other. My problem is when people use excuses on why they only date a certain race other than their own race.

  32. WOW. I have heard so many people voice this sentiment about Barack Obama’s wife Michelle. Granted, if he’s happy with her I’m all for it but throughout this campaign I have felt like perhaps I am not proud enough for some reason. All the black women I know; especially those who are older are just enamored by this woman. They call her beautiful. I think she’s attractive enough; but I wouldn’t call her beautiful. I don’t think she has a great sense of style and I have repeatedly wished Oprah would hook her up with her personal hairstylist because I hate the stuffy way she wears her hair.Don’t get me wrong. She is obviously intelligent and I am glad she and Barack are happy and seem to have a great bond and happy family–but my vote for him had nothing to do with her. Now, I don’t think Barack would have been elected without her BUT she personally didn’t do anything for me or change how I felt about him. Nor has she really made me feel any better (or worse) about myself as a black woman. Perhaps its because I’m cynical. It seems like black people (and some white people )are just glad she’s not white and therefore transferring all these positive attributes onto her in addition to those she already posesses. Almost to the point of putting her on a pedestal she can’t possibly stay on. While understandable; I worry that she like her husband will crumble under all these added expectations that come with the mere color of their skin.Okay I also grew up in majority white schools most of my life; but what I found is that typically black males don’t suffer in the dating game the way black women do which definitely contributes to the hard feelings. A black boy, especially if he’s a jock or Will Smith type will be accosted by the white girls even if he’s not chasing them. My mom used to have to chase white girls off our lawn and take the phone off the hook because they were so aggressive about pursuing my older brother who is a dead ringer for Rick Fox of the Lakers.BUT Even the most gorgeous black girl (Halle Berry talks about this in talking about her high school days) will not be chased in the same way by the white boys in the very same environment. I was always told how “gorgeous” I was “for a black girl” but those white boys were not taking me to the prom! They were not calling the house or showing up uninvited the way those white girls would for my brother. Likewise, when I switched to a school with more black guys I found that only a small subset of black girls were desired. I was a part of that group admittedly– and that wasthe black girls those who were most similar to white girls in terms of figure, length of hair and other features –they might be considered BUT by and large no matter what their background (two parents or one; rich or poor) the black boys put most of their efforts into chasing after the white girls. Of course there was an undercurrent of sexual availability that obviously results in erroneous stereotypes but that’s a factor too. Typically most black girls aren’t dating until 16 or 17–white girls are at 13 or 14 in a lot of cases–and the logic followed that those girls would be easier and more willing to do sexual things because they are in “the game” earlier than black girls. At least in a suburban environment where black parents tend to overprotect.Now that I am older I am approached by white men far more often than black men. I always had a preference for black men but what I would often find is that black men were very wrapped up in “my outer shell”. That is they seemed to put a high value on the texture of my hair and lighter color of my skin–many expressing how it would be great if I was even lighter. Yes, really, college educated black men. Whereas when I date black guy I tend to know he’s really attracted to and likes the inner ME becaue his culture puts no premium on those things and frankly he is likely to be getting flack for being with more than props.

  33. OOPS that last line should refer to when I date a white I tend to know he’s really attracted to and likes the inner ME becaue his culture puts no premium on those things and frankly he is likely to be getting flack for being with more than props.

  34. okay I just keep messing that last line up every time I try to correct it. Bottom line, to a white guy, I’m dark skinned because I am not white, so therefore the fact that I am lighter than some other black woman or my hair is less kinky really doesn’t seem to get him jazzed the way it does a black man so I have little worry that he’s dating me for that reason alone. In fact I figure he must be pretty open minded when he is just as bombarded with the positive images of white woman and negative images of black women as black men are.However; I am often asked by black men and other black women if they think my current boyfriend– who is successful and attractive and white–would be dating me if I were not, in their words, “black barbie”. They see me physically as being a white woman, painted brown and believe most white men see me the same way–negating the idea that they are more open minded about black women in general. Who knows?

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